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More "Penryn" details emerge

Despite the plethora of attention Penryn received over the last few weeks, Intel's newest roadmaps put the processor launch for Q1'08.  This indicates the launch has not necessarily accelerated even though the initial tape-out proved extremely successful.

On the other hand, Intel's 2008 roadmap shows every segment simultaneously deploying 45nm products.  Like AMD's recent 65nm Brisbane launch, Intel guidance notes the processors will start shipping Q4'07 but the actual launch will come as a coordinated 2008 event.

The first Intel 45nm treatments will come from the quad-core Yorkfield and dual-core Wolfdale desktop processors.  Wolfdale has two physical cores on a single die and up to 6MB of L2 cache.  Yorkfield is then two Wolfdale dice on a single package. Also worth noting: Wolfdale ships with a 1333MHz front-side bus and Yorkfield ships with a 1066MHz front-side bus.  Chipset support will largely come from Bearlake-family that was previously disclosed on DailyTech.

Perhaps the most interesting thing about these two processors is the return of Hyper-Threading.  This, however, does not mean that Yorkfield will appear as eight logical cores, nor does it mean Wolfdale will appear as four logical cores. Intel's internal guidance on the subject specifically claims the processor will ship with Hyper-Threading, but will only utilize 4 threads.  On every Intel roadmap in the past, Hyper-Threading doubles the amount of listed threads in the guidance documentation.  Clearly, there is more of a mystery here still.  (Update: Please read the retraction below.)

"The official company policy is that our engineers have left the door open for Hyper-Threading, but we cannot confirm or deny any future plans for the technology," adds Intel Public Relations Manager Dan Snyder.

All Penryn cores also include Intel TXT, previously known as Intel LaGrande Technology.  TXT stands for Trusted Execution Technology and refers to the collection of devices.  The Trusted Platform Module, or TPM, is one component. DMA page protection is another. 

Alas, even if 2008 seems like a long time away for the 45nm platform, it's important to note that all Intel platforms will have 45nm SKUs in Q1'08.  Penryn, the family name for Intel's first generation 45nm consumer CPUs, also refers specifically to the 45nm dual-core mobile CPU.  Intel's current roadmap claims this processor will lead the Q1'08 mobile push with several low voltage models coming one quarter later.

For servers, Wolfdale will make an appearance as a dual and single socket Xeon.  It's been long-standing Intel policy to separate desktop, mobile and server chipsets into different products; Conroe was the Core 2 desktop CPU and Woodcrest, though physically nearly identical, was the Xeon counterpart.  Wolfdale as a server and a desktop CPU indicates the chips are electrically identical -- though each will likely receive different packaging for the different sockets. 

Yorkfield will not receive the same codenaming treatment as Wolfdale on the server. Instead, Harpertown will be the quad-core Xeon for two socket servers.  Yorkfield will still be the company’s single-socket quad-core Xeon offering.

Update 01/31/2007:  Channel sources have reached out to DailyTech to emphasize that the addition of Hyper-Threading to Penryn-family processors in 2008 is incorrect and the result of dated channel data.  My feelings and thoughts about the retraction can be read on my blog.


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Theinquirer.net picked up on this too
By mlittl3 on 1/30/2007 8:03:26 PM , Rating: 2
RE: Theinquirer.net picked up on this too
By Marlowe on 1/30/2007 8:41:44 PM , Rating: 2
Of course :) ..and 5 days ago also notice.. =)

And below this post, at the bottom where I'm sure it will end up, DT have added these quotes.. just like on some other tech news site I know of :D (hint: it's red) Hihi!


RE: Theinquirer.net picked up on this too
By Dactyl on 1/30/2007 10:11:42 PM , Rating: 2
The Inq is a damn fine source of journalism.


RE: Theinquirer.net picked up on this too
By James Holden on 1/30/2007 10:21:17 PM , Rating: 3
It's easy to get it right when you've reported every possible outcome.


RE: Theinquirer.net picked up on this too
By Dactyl on 1/31/2007 4:38:19 AM , Rating: 2
Digging up some info, confirming it with multiple sources, and then breaking a story is journalism.

Retracting that story when new information becomes available is also journalism.

Why did DailyTech run this story? There are two possibilities, neither of which makes the Inq look bad:

1: Kubicki talked to one or more of his sources, and they confirmed that Penryn will have HT. If his sources say so, then it's hard to fault the Inq for hearing similar information from their sources!

2: Kubicki didn't talk to any sources.


RE: Theinquirer.net picked up on this too
By crystal clear on 1/31/2007 8:04:37 AM , Rating: 3
Quote-
"Why did DailyTech run this story? "

Because I asked this question below-

By crystal clear on 1/27/07, Rating: 2
By crystal clear on 1/27/2007 4:53:24 AM , Rating: 2

"Penryn is still not without its mysteries;"

Penryn cores will have HT re-enabled. -can Kristopher check
if this true.

Unquote-

Daily Tech is still not without its mysteries-HA.....

Quote-

"Kubicki talked to one or more of his sources"

Unquote-
Read this-

Life With "Penryn"
Kristopher Kubicki (Blog) - January 27, 2007 12:01 AM

DailyTech had the opportunity to chat with Mark Bohr, Intel Senior Fellow, and Steve Smith, Intel Vice President DEG Group Operations, about the upcoming CPU design......

Unquote-

Now you know the source.

Quote-

"Kubicki didn't talk to any sources"

Hey dont pass judgements-It will backfire on you -A dirty surprise -like my post did the job.

Quote-

"then it's hard to fault the Inq for hearing similar information from their sources! "

Unquote-

Lets go to Inq & lets see what they write-YES here it is-
Read on..........

Quote-

Penryn does not have HT

Multiple wrong sources


By Charlie Demerjian: Wednesday 31 January 2007, 07:42

DESPITE MULTIPLE documents saying it has HT, our earlier story is wrong.
Penryn does not have HT, nor will it ever. That banner is left up to Nehalem in late 2008.

More than enough engineers, Lenovo sales people in outer Mongolia and the usual rabble picketing my house all confirm that it is not there.

Sorry for the confusion. µ


Unquote-

What source they have-Some sales people,engineers etc .....


By James Holden on 1/31/2007 11:36:01 AM , Rating: 2
http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hyperthre...

There's a 30mil transistor difference between Conroe and Penryn once you remove cache. Some of that is SSE4.

Like I said, the inquirer has a good habit of being right when they predict every possible outcome.


TPM
By ajfink on 1/30/2007 8:49:52 PM , Rating: 2
I can't believe TPM crap is actually finding its way into new hardware. For a while I thought software and hardware companies might play it cool and force media companies to adapt to a different world (which they would have to do, or die), instead they've caved and DRM is being built into everything. Not related to any of the other posts...just something I needed to vent. Let the other discussions continue, :)




RE: TPM
By The Boston Dangler on 1/30/2007 9:19:49 PM , Rating: 2
Intel's LaGrande tech was developed very closely with MS's Paladin on the software side. I would be very surprised if AMD didn't follow suit. With cross-licensing agreements, they might just do a "cut and paste". After all, it would be suicide to field a product which caused Vista / OSX and later to say:

"Sorry, this audio/video/software is not allowed to run on this machine because it is not a Trusted Platform. Look, I don't care if it WAS obtained legally, you still haven't spent enough money."


RE: TPM
By Viditor on 1/30/2007 9:31:47 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I would be very surprised if AMD didn't follow suit


True. Both Intel's LaGrande and AMD's Presidio do the same thing essentially...they were launched almost simultaneously.


RE: TPM
By ajfink on 1/30/2007 9:44:05 PM , Rating: 2
I know, I just don't like it in totality.


Welcomed?
By bunnyfubbles on 1/31/2007 1:52:11 AM , Rating: 2
I'd thought HT existed on the P4 platform to compensate for inefficient design (in order to achieve marketable GHz).

Now that Intel went back to performance despite the GHz, will HT really help performance or are they exploiting the now marketable HT terminology like they were exploiting GHz with the P4?




RE: Welcomed?
By Dribble on 1/31/2007 1:38:36 PM , Rating: 2
HT just made more efficient use of the processor. Because of the P4's long pipeline as the instruction goes down it most of the pipeline isn't in use. All hyperthreading did was start a second thread running in the spare bits of pipeline. There was a slight performance hit (mainly because with 2 threads you have more competition for the available cache), but generally where you had multiple threads running you got something like 10-15% better performance. Perhaps more importantly if 1 thread goes banana's and maxed out the cpu you still had the second thread left to do stuff (stopping windows completely grinding to a halt).

It made XP feel more responsive then faster non-hyperthreaded athlons for general desktop work imo (although you're average AMD fanboy would happily spend hours telling you it didn't).


Curiouser and curiouser
By Justin Case on 1/31/2007 7:25:44 PM , Rating: 2
Interesting. The Inquirer says Penryn will have HT, and DT publishes a whole "article" saying the same thing, three days later, where it doesn't mention the Inquirer as a source. Then the Inquirer says "no, actually it won't have HT", and guess what, 16 hours later DT publishes the same thing, again attributing this to "channel sources".

I guess now we know where DT gets its "news". Might as well go to the source (ie, the Inquirer). It might be as unreliable as DT, but at least they're faster and write with wit.

My money says the Inquirer published that just to test how long it would take some other site to pick it up and say they'd got it from some "secret source"...




By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 2/1/2007 8:42:08 AM , Rating: 2
Or, you could read my blog about what really happened.


typo
By kenji4life on 1/30/2007 10:45:26 PM , Rating: 2
Wofldale has two physical cores on a single die and up to 6MB of L2 cache.




By clemedia on 1/30/2007 10:50:25 PM , Rating: 2
Maybe it's just my geekiness, but HT seems to get process priorities all screwed up. You end up with threads that SHOULD be only using idle CPU cycles chewing up cpu cycles that should be revserved for other higher priority processes because you have a "virtual CPU" that is idle at the time.




Cant Wait
By Perium on 1/31/2007 12:20:59 AM , Rating: 2
Who doesn't want dual core proc's to look like 4???




Rapid response
By crystal clear on 1/31/2007 7:36:43 AM , Rating: 2
Thank you for the rapid response-

HT re enabled
By crystal clear on 1/27/07, Rating: 2
By crystal clear on 1/27/2007 4:53:24 AM , Rating: 2

"Penryn is still not without its mysteries;"

Penryn cores will have HT re-enabled. -can Kristopher check
if this true.






hyperthreading
By hellokeith on 1/31/2007 10:11:05 AM , Rating: 2
HT --> is teh pwn
\----> pwns ADM




Add on this.....
By crystal clear on 1/31/2007 10:19:46 AM , Rating: 2
Some marketing news-

Quote-

"Intel to keep 65nm-based processors as main hit for 2-way servers throughout 2007"

Intel will position its 65nm-based Dual-Core Xeon 5100 sequence (Woodcrest) and Quad-Core Xeon 5300 sequence (Clovertown) series processors as the main force in the 2-way server market in 2007, and will not begin introducing its 45nm-based quad-core (Harpertown) and dual-core (Wolfdale) processors until 2008, according to sources familiar with Intel's plans.

Intel has scheduled to continually raise the shipping ratio of Clovertown processors for 2-way servers from 30% in the first quarter 2007, to 70% in fourth quarter. While Woodcrest processors will drop from 60% in first quarter to 30% in fourth quarter, added the sources.

The longer product cycle is expected to help bring a measure of stabilization to